Bandai Entertainment (US) has the rights to R2??

[cardslash02.livejournal.com]

Hey all,

I was hearing some disturbing rumors from Anime Boston today that season 2 has BEEN LICENSED. Now I don't know if this is official or not, but according to some dialogue at the industry panel today:
[20:31:06] do you have R2?

[20:31:11] yes, we will be handling R2 as well

Source: http://envirosphere.com/
I talked to a guy who was at the panel who heard this information directly.

Well folks, I hope this does not seriously impact us getting timely fansubs.
Discuss!

Comments

[lisa-patrikevna.livejournal.com]

You know, US isn't the only country in the world. If US licenses Code Geass, it doesn't mean that fansub groups all over the world should stop fansubbing it.

Moreover, as kitsune_no_ame said, not everyone has access to US DVDs.
And not everyone want to listen to a crappy dub.

[konekodarkness.livejournal.com]

Unfortunately the majority of fansub are in english, and they should respect that this series - if it has - has been licensed and should not fansub it. Why is this so hard for people to understand?

I am an artist, I live on people buying my work and it really upsets me that people think they can just download an artist(s)' work for free.

Oh and most US dvds have subtitles - I personally have not liked a single dub done by america, but that does not excuse you from not supporting the industry.

[lisa-patrikevna.livejournal.com]

So what? You live in UK, and your language is English. English is the dominant international language. US doesn't own any rights for English.
Why would, for example fansubbers from UK, Australia, Canada, New Zealand and so on should stop fansubbing, if it wasn't licensed in their countries?

I buy japanese DVDs. I won't support Taniguchi, Okouchi and other creators by buying US DVDs.

Why would I want to support American industry? They're making money, not anime.

[kaleidoruby.livejournal.com]

They don't just get the US rights, they also get the Canadian rights when they license. It's for all of North America.

[lisa-patrikevna.livejournal.com]

Okay, count out Canada. Still, there are plenty of countries where English is an official language and the anime is not licensed.

[kaleidoruby.livejournal.com]

Yeah, I agree. I don't think it being licensed will stop subbers, anyway. Some places wait for DVDs to be released before they start pulling their subs, and considering that Code Geass is getting a TV run, it'll be a long while before we see official NA releases of R2.

[konekodarkness.livejournal.com]

Because you are taking away profits from the JAPANESE companies, yes the american companies get their share but a large percentage still goes back to the original makers and they need our support in order for the industry to go on. If there wasn't following in America then we would not see the quantity and quality of anime we see now. I'm amazed CR2 looks as good as it does, it's rare to see anime of that quality nowadays, thanks to fans thinking they can have anything they want for free, though I am glad to hear you buy the japanese dvds.

You will be supporting the creators if you buy the american dvds. I get royalties from my work no matter where it goes or in what language it appears, that's how I survive.

[lisa-patrikevna.livejournal.com]

You see, the point is that I wouldn't buy any anime DVDs (Japanese or American) if I there wasn't fansubbed version first. If not for fansubs, I wouldn't have any interest in anime at all.

Look at it this way. Japanese company spends money and creates anime, then they spend money ant air it on TV to advertise it, and then they propose to fans to buy DVD, merchandise and so on. So japanese people know what they buy, they can see it on tv for free.

American company buys license, translates anime, releases DVDs and says "support the industry", "stop fansubbing". But they only occasionally air it on tv, and if they do, only people who live in broadcast area (US + Canada) can watch it. And it's TV broadcast that makes people buy DVDs, not "support the industry" stuff. For example, how many people would buy "Lost" DVDs without TV broadcast? - Zero. It's because people already seen it on TV, they buy it to have an opportunity to rewatch it as many times as they want, not to support the industry. In general, they just want us to buy anime that we didn't see. And moreover, they try to take away the opportunity to see an anime at all from people outside US and Canada. For example, Viz Media ships US and Canada only, but they made sure to shut down most of the Death Note fansub groups, regardless the fact that some of them were european.

We don't have to support the industry, it's not charitable institution. If they want to make money, they need to adapt to the market. As Gonzo did (http://japanator.com/elephant/post.phtml?pk=7587), for example. Anime is popular worldwide due to fansubbers, not licensors. So, when licensor says "nobody buys our DVDs because of fansubs", they lie. Nobody buys them because it's not convenient, the wait is too long, shipping matters and other stuff. And the market is made by customers, not sellers.

Though, I suspect that I've gone OT. Sorry.

[rainbow-cnxn.livejournal.com]

I made two long, long posts in fandomsecrets about this once, but I'm too lazy to find my responses so I'll just say this much:

WORD.

Basically... Is fansubbing/distributing an anime once it's licensed illegal? Yes, sorta. (Copyright law is all sorts of wonky.) Is it wrong? Kinda, BUT.

There's a market imbalance. They're asking us to buy a product that we have not seen. Now, it's within their right as producers of this commodity to say that. However, in this day and age, consumers have far more power over purchasing decisions. We want to be able to preview what we're getting. Back before high-speed internet, this was kinda impossible. Now, though, technology affords us this convenience, despite its (highly) questionable legal standing. And you know what? Like consumers of any product, after we sample, there's a good chance that we won't buy. You can't expect everyone who watches Heroes to go out and buy the DVD's. You can't expect everyone who watches R2 to go out and buy the DVD's, either.

"But wait!" you say, "You're paying to be able to watch it in the first place! Plus, you get a hard copy of it, too!"

True, but no. This is a perfect example of business models not meeting the challenge of technological advances. Consumers simply will not stand for it. Therefore, fansubbing! Are we being greedy bastards? Yeah. Are Sunrise/Bandai being greedy bastards, too? Yeah. The law says that we are in the wrong here, but with the anonymity of the internet, who the hell cares, right? Right?

It's just how it works.

A better business model:

American TV producers have caught on. Offering TV shows online for free but with commercials has been a great idea. This way, they can increase their viewership, introduce the series to new people, and get advertising revenue in one fell swoop. If Japanese anime producers can find some way of doing the same (and incorporate fansubbers in for timely subs), I'm sure that they'll find fansubbing and illegal downloading drop by a shit-ton. And this way, they'll have more viewers, and as we know, more viewers = more DVD sales.

[lisa-patrikevna.livejournal.com]

I don't really get why are you answering me. And I don't see where our opinions differ. Because that was exactly my point: if producers can adapt to the market, "they'll find fansubbing and illegal downloading drop by a shit-ton".

[rainbow-cnxn.livejournal.com]

Just agreeing you with you. ;)

[lisa-patrikevna.livejournal.com]

Oh, ok. ♪
I'm glad that our opinions match.

[konekodarkness.livejournal.com]

I agree. I started out with fansubs for most of the series I watch. There is no advertisements in the UK, no adverts, we only just got animecentral a couple of months ago. That's it. It's terrible marketing, and they are not keeping up with the times, it's their own fault they're losing money.

Don't worry I scream at these companies telling them they need to adapt their marketing skills and SPEED!

The problem is is that there are a large community of fans who only want fansubs and will not support what they watch, thinking they can get it for free. Fansubs used to be for series which would never make it to dvd in another country and that's what I love about fansubs, but now that it's going to America, those subbing in english should stop.

I can see this is an issue which will not go away in a long time and I hope the industry finds a way so that we're not reliant on fansubs before the industry does start to show crippling damage. There's already a lot of damage behind the scenes on both the American and Japanese sides.

No need to apologise, a heated debate warms the heart every now and then.

[lisa-patrikevna.livejournal.com]

I think that a large community of fans who only want fansubs will not buy DVDs even if fansubs cease to exist. They'll most probably just drop anime. Because their point of view based either on lack of money, either on indifference to anime itself.

I too hope that industry will adapt. ))

For that matter...

[rainbow-cnxn.livejournal.com]

What's to keep Sunrise from simply ganking the subs from fansubbers and marketing that online with commercials? This way, they'll get free, decent quality subs, and they can air it legally online while attracting more viewers and advertising revenue. It's not like fansubbers fall within the bounds of legality.

[trickyfrog.livejournal.com]

I COMPLETELY AGREE!!

Anime isn't like movies we see in the theatres, or tv shows we see on a major network. I watch fansubs and THEN, I purchase the US relaeases and simply watch the subtitled versions.

I will not pay for soemthing that I don't know what it is, because there is a chance I'm spending $30 for something I'll hate!

Once I know I like it, which means after watching the fansubs, I buy the US versions to support the industry.

Geneon going out of bussiness is a prime example of how people are being spoiled and taking advantage of the "fansubbing" idea.

[darksage29.livejournal.com]

that's not the point.
Our point is we can't all have the DVD because one, some of us don't live in america, and two, we don't have the money to purchase the DVD even if we wanted to.
I understand your concern. Fansubbing is somewhere in the realm of copyright infringement. But the fact remains that the fan community looks at licensing as very disturbing news just because we can't get our hands on the goods.

...Just like you and your art, I doubt that you will like it if a large percentage of the community is not exposed to your art and therefore wouldn't buy from you.

[konekodarkness.livejournal.com]

I don't live in america either, and I'm not on a great wage. I'm an artist!

Somewhere in the realm of copywright? It is copywright infringement.

No I wouldn't want my art splashed over the internet, I don't mind a sample of my work on the internet but not the whole lot.

[dark-alone.livejournal.com]

o.o

mind if i friend you?
i reading your posts and thinking: 'what an interesting person' ^_^

[konekodarkness.livejournal.com]

Yes you can friend me. *laughs* naww, I'm just passionate about this issue.

[dark-alone.livejournal.com]

i'm passionate about people actually trying to buy the DVDs, but don't like to get into debates, so I don't say much about. lol
Plus if you don't say anything in response they think they've won, and i hate that. XD

I just babble about the RAWs and forget to watch the subs...