(no subject)

[spleener.livejournal.com]

So Xing Ke and Kaguya are obviously calling bullshit on last episode's shenanigans- well, it's possible that they haven't been told the real story, but somehow I doubt it given their positions in the organization. While I expected this from Xing Ke, I must say, Kaguya's surprisingly smart under her usual LOL ZERO IS MAI HASBANDO ^_^ exterior. Then again it's possible that her ZERO IS MAI HASBANDO LOL attitude is what let her realize that maybe they were being hasty in passing judgement on him, since most everyone else already didn't really trust him.

On a related note, did anybody else notice that between him talking about how they should make up a story about Zero being dead and the scene later where he talks about Ougi not being right for his role Diethard got his face roughed up a bit? I suppose this is going to be like Cecile's dress in episode 8, another random thing that we're not going to find the story behind until the picture/audio dramas get there.


So did anybody else go "WELL IF YOU HAD COME TO THIS CONCLUSION ABOUT 40 FUCKING EPISODES AGO IT WOULD'VE SAVED EVERYONE A LOT OF TROUBLE" at this line?

In all honesty, though, I do like his "while preaching on about methods over results, what I really valued were ideals and aesthetics" line, he does have a point in that all this time he was failing to realize that there's a difference between what feels like the right thing to do and what actually is the right thing to do. Not to say that what he's doing right now is the right thing to do, he's obviously completely fucking snapped, which is most likely JUST AS PLANNED for Schniezel.

And Marianne's personality is about what I expected given previous information. I'm wondering if her lack of concern for her son is an 'I have confidence my son can pull his own ass out of the fire' thing or a 'screw that kid, I just care about my keikaku' thing, though. I suspect the latter (unless of course her aforementioned keikaku also involves helping him out in some way.)

Comments

[tanzentravis.livejournal.com]

What is "keikaku"?

[kasumi-blue.livejournal.com]

It's Japanese for "plan" or "scheme."

[kiriska.livejournal.com]

Suzaku's sudden Machiavelliian attitude pisses me off given the last 40 episodes, yeah. :| Good job, asshole.

Well, now we know why Zero rated Kaguya's intelligence so damn high. xD More civil war within the BK? I think so.

[nayami.livejournal.com]

Sheesh, it's not like character development is a bad thing.

[demyx.livejournal.com]

I actually have to wonder about Marianne too. I remember when she approached C.C., C.C. mentioned something about her showing up because of Lelouch and Marianne said something alone the lines of "Do you think I'm that kind of ideal mother?" I mean, I need to watch that episode again probably, but the way it was worded... I dunno, Marianne was described as being a loving mother, so I'm guessing she does have total confidence in her son or she does intend to help him at some point and is just being light-hearted about it (I would assume the second one fits her character more but hell, I know nothing about Marianne except that she was supposed to be dead).

And I feel so bad for Suzaku. When he finally realizes that his way of thinking wasn't working out for him, he's gone off the deep end. He's tried so hard to hang onto his ideals for changing the world in a gentler way, doing it the "right" way without violence and this is the last straw for him. I never really blamed him for trying to hold onto his moral high ground, I think he was really horrified with himself after he killed his father and he naturally had trouble accepting that he could be someone who could and would cut down their own family for "results". Episode 18 sort of woke him up, showing him that even if he didn't want to, he HAD to abandon his ideals because it just wasn't working for him, or at this point, there's really no point in holding onto them. Who is he trying to impress now that everyone is dead/hates him?

I mean, yeah, he COULD have abandoned his ideals sooner but that's not what Suzaku was trying to do. He just wanted to do things his way, much like Lelouch, and in the end it made him lose everything... just like Lelouch. This isn't really an improvement for him, he's just in the same position as Lelouch where's he got nothing to lose, so to hell with it, right?

That's just my two cents, I think I kinda went on a tangent with Suzaku, LOL.

edit: ON ANOTHER NOTE, DOES IT BUG ANYONE HOW QUALITY THIS EPISODE WAS? Seriously, is it just me? I mean, it was like... episode 13 bad. Like Gurren Lagann episode 4 bad.

[able.livejournal.com]

took the words right out of my mouth

[susure.livejournal.com]

Yeah, in all scenes that weren't headshots, the animation was terrible. But they're winding down and probably have to save the budget for the last couple of eps.

Does anyone think that Marianne is not actually Anya but controlling Anya? Because C.C. asks her, "you came all the way here?" which would imply she was not Anya all along. Plus, while we know Marianne has a Geass, it doesn't mean Anya does. Rather, glowing red irises imply she is under Geass's effects.

[spleener.livejournal.com]

To be honest I think that most of the impression of QUALITY was created by that first shot of Suzaku. Not that the rest of the episode was perfect, but still, I don't think people would have noticed it as much if not for that shot.

[inastr8jacket.livejournal.com]

We know close to nothing about Marianne so it's hard to predict what type of person she is and what she's planning to do, other than helping Lelouch out in some way. What I want to know is what's going to happen to Anya? Marianne took over her body, but does that make Anya lost? To be honest, I found the whole scene pretty cheap, or at least, very rushed. Especially with C.C. getting her memories back.

Actually this whole episode was rushed. I don't feel like a lot was explained in this episode. I think I'll rewatch it in case I missed something. Also, I wanted to see more of Bismark vs. Suzaku (They were actually fighting. With SWORDS!)

I'm kind of miffed that Suzaku and Lelouch pretty much exchanged their beliefs. I can't see Lelouch as the kind of guy to take the methods into serious consideration. It seems like it would... slow him down or something? But I agree with everything demyx said, so... read that. However! Suzaku and Lelouch just keep losing more. By going with the coup, Suzaku has a couple more enemies. And what about Gino? I don't think he's the type to make a complete turnaround, but he's pissed. Lelouch sealed himself away with Charles so, yeah, there's a loss (but he'll pull himself out somehow, of course) But that conversation with Rivalz? Bawww ;_;

The animation of this episode was pretty bad. It kind of hurt. Lelouch looked pretty good, but... that's it. Everything was really messy.

[kurosaki-ichi.livejournal.com]

haah suzaku got owned so easily in swordfight with Bismark XD

[tarkara.livejournal.com]

Lelouch geassed the artists to draw him well and everyone else badly.

[koyuki-azumaya.livejournal.com]

Y'know, I wouldn't be surprised if that was what actually happened XD

[consequences.livejournal.com]

I agree about Suzaku. :\ I don't like how his 'results' view now is really similar to how Lulu is, since they're supposed to be foils for each other, etc. Don't know how fandom will take this.

Um, yeah, that's all I have to say. o-o

[eire-endellion.livejournal.com]

I don't like how his 'results' view now is really similar to how Lulu is

I agree. I dun like how he's just turned into Lulu now D= It makes me sad. Which is why R1!Suzaku is always going to be more awesome than R2!Suzaku =D

[sevetenks.livejournal.com]

My biggest thing about this ep was



'bout fuckin' time he thought do do this =A=

[rawrrdoll.livejournal.com]

Idem..xDDDDD!
and Yeah C.C is back ;__;!

[dragonphoenix77.livejournal.com]

I didn't really like the whole I-be-pushy thing with Suzaku, I think he should stick to his ideals. I am impressed and somewhat pleased that he and Lelouch are now somewhat on the "same side", though that just may be the fangirl coming out in me. :D; But I think that this is really painful for him, and that he actually is sane and not cracked. He knows exactly what he's doing and he's doing it because to him, it's like: "Hell, what do I have to lose? This is what can work, and I'm going to go with it."

Also, was Marianne inside Anya all along? Or is she actually Anya? That was an interesting twist- I knew there'd be something with Anya later on, but I never suspected it'd be this.

Aaaand the art in the beginning really threw me off, I wasn't actually sure if I was watching the right thing or not... I also went back twice to check if I was on the right episode...

[spleener.livejournal.com]

Also, was Marianne inside Anya all along? Or is she actually Anya?

Given that Marianne-Anya has the same eyes that people being affected by Rolo or Lulu's Geasses have, I'm guessing that her Geass is to basically possess people. Or maybe it's more like that Marianne's become Anya's second personality through the Geass? Regardless, Anya's probably just some poor random noble girl who wound up being the target for Marianne's Geass. Though at the same time I suppose that maybe Anya's piloting skills could come from having Marianne inside her, so I suppose that the relationship isn't entirely parasitic.

Still though, I LOL at the thought of this happening:

Marianya: So the whole secret to everything that you need to know to stop Charles and/or Schniezel is-
Orange: hay guyz wutz goin on here *canceler*
Anya: ...what am I doing here?
Everyone else: FFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFF

[silentorphan.livejournal.com]

So did anybody else go "WELL IF YOU HAD COME TO THIS CONCLUSION ABOUT 40 FUCKING EPISODES AGO IT WOULD'VE SAVED EVERYONE A LOT OF TROUBLE" at this line?

Sunrise deliberately made it ironic since Lelouch's voiceover for the preview of next week's ep included, roughly: "Maybe Suzaku was right. Maybe what matter are the methods, not the results."

Thankfully, Lelouch is pragmatic enough to know that he's in too deep by now, so he won't be changing HIS methodology.

[brisent.livejournal.com]

What's needed are...results. WHO IS THE FATHER? Hmmm.

Then everyone goes crazy and blows each other up, all in the while vaporizing the world. After the zombie attack. Yeah, that's my crack theory.

[fluffyfledgling.livejournal.com]

LOL

[dorkbunny.livejournal.com]

Mm, yeah, I was really taken back by the QUALITY! of this episode too, and also how rushed everything was. However it does make me look forward to how awesome the new upcoming episodes are going to be. :3 (Or I hope, anyways.)

Something tells me that Lelouch is going to have his wish about watching fireworks with Rivals & co. granted... just not in the way that he expected and in a really, really sad way. Like... I dunno, Lulu and his Ashford buddies are all gathered together somehow and he sees them die as there are fireworks via exploding mecha in the sky. Something like that. BUT I really hope not. ;_; I'd very much rather have a happy, yay-we-all-made-it-through type firework watching with the ones that DID make it through.

Still don't know how I feel about Suzaku's 360 turn. I mean, they are somewhat on the same side now, and I've always wanted them to team up together since the Mao episode, but this way... I don't know. :\

(Not even commenting on the Anya/Marianne. xD; I'm still in wt...f?-mode about that. Just trusting that the next episode will clear things up. And yay, okaerinasai, CC!~ ♥)

[dorkbunny.livejournal.com]

OH, and, C.C. going back to get her Cheese-kun before departing with Anyianne (Mariya?) was priceless. Too cute :3

[strawberrypenis.livejournal.com]

Let me start off with how I am pissed off at this episode.

WTF. Seriously Anya is Marianne? okay I refuse to believe. I think Anya is under Marianne's Geass controlling her (Anya had red rings around her eyes which is a sign she's under geass) which pisses me off the most because she is supposed to be dead! Lelouch has done all this for her and Nunnally and this bitch was alive. She should have done something much sooner to prevent this from happening. Also in this episode it made her seem like she's bad eps. with this wording "Did you think I was that ideal of a mother?". With that said I wonder what this will all lead up to.

Suzaku. It's just like what Spleener said, he's 40 episodes too late. He should have reconized this much, much sooner...say like after Euphy died? but he's stupid and I agree with tarkara he IS Syaoran (TRC has character's that look alike but can be totally different right? but that's not important.) Anyway I do support that he did try to make things better with his own beliefs, it was a nice try and tons had his back. I wish the fight he had with Bismark had lasted longer, I was so effing happy they were fighting with swords but he ran then fell into a ditch. Anyways I'm so glad he went ape shit because he is more in touch with reality (maybe).

The whole Quality thing didn't bother me much, I think they story line is what's the problem. Anyway Ougi's way is retarded even if Lulu did use the Knights, suck it up man. Schniezel plotting against his father makes me love him even more. Poor Rivalz he is probably alone at the academy. Lulu you sealed yourself with Charles, wtf master plan do you have? and finally I wish Kallen would return to Lulu's side soon. (I'm happy I saw a Penguin in this episode at least XD)

[kuroshin.livejournal.com]

Hmm... Finally, Suzaku is off his idealism ass but I just don't like how he's become much more Lulu-like all of a sudden. Character development is not a bad thing, anyway.

Lulu being "Do as I say" person really intensifies my man-crush on him!

On a relative sidenote, Marianne is Anya? Or is it that Marianne has a geass that enables her to place her consciousness on another person, tha being Anya which Marianne did bedore she died. I dunno. As far as the Ep 20 is concerned, that's the best that I can come up with.

[vicks111.livejournal.com]

Schneizel needs more love! Seriously, though FINALLY made a stance. And we are still not sure what he might be aiming at.

"He finally made a decision"
Your words, my thoughts exactly Kanon. Especially since I actually sat down the other day to try and figure him out (waste of time, meh, but at least I was writting!), and at least I'm glad to say I got part of him down XD
...I think I'll head off and write some more... :P

I WANT SCHNEIZEL TO GO "JUST AS PLANNED" AT THE END OF GEASS...just not as bastard as certain Kiras...

And would someone PLEASE stop being condecending to Cornelia. Badass Princess needs to hear her Knight died an honorable death? Give her some credit, I still want her to cry her eyes out, especially SINCE she told VILLETA of all people that STATUS is not the most important thing, and HE'S F'ING DEAD!!! not that he will come back or anything to have an ever after with her.

Anya/Marianne: I'm going to hold off my opinion of this until the explanation is complete, and then I'll go WTF. Hey Clamp, you've at least taught me something! though C.C's comeback was laaaaame.

Orenji-kun, be your awesome knight self to your prince and go save him from Emperor-chan. That's one character I wouldn't mind seeing dying an awesome knight death from saving his charge.

[vicks111.livejournal.com]

oh, and The Black Knights (officers) are just full of Bull. As if they weren't using Zero JUST because he gave results. That's why the Indians also supported, they were looking for results and Zero supplied; Lakshata wouldn't have seen it as treason (and Diethard was pretty much gave in the peer pressure). And Urabe, the only one that realized that Zero had changed and wasn't like that and would have DEFENDED him, died on episode 2. Tanaguchi sure likes his irony. and his last thoughts were of Lakshata, when she hasn't thought about him at all LOL

Kaguya, you are full of win. I want her to come back from Kaminejima and set in straight everyone. She sure showed pwned her supremacy over all of the officers. Kaguya/Zero new OTP (since Cornelia/Guildford is dead now T__T and if CC dies or something)

Gino, your loyalty to the Emperor deserves my respects. But, seriously? Just tag along with Schneizel (or Lulu! or become Cornelia's new knight, or something) don't waste your time on Emperor-chan.

[rainbow-cnxn.livejournal.com]

So did anybody else go "WELL IF YOU HAD COME TO THIS CONCLUSION ABOUT 40 FUCKING EPISODES AGO IT WOULD'VE SAVED EVERYONE A LOT OF TROUBLE" at this line?
Alas, there was no nuke 40 episodes ago. Nothing induces a change in character like massive emotional trauma upon massive emotional trauma. =Db Anyways, character development is not exactly a bad thing. And it's not like he or Zero are in the "right" or "wrong". If either of them (doesn't matter whom, really) had just given up, everyone's stories would likely have had a happier (or at least a more alive) end.

In general, the fanbase seems to preoccupy itself on trying to gauge who is comparatively more right or wrong for any given episode, when (at least to me) it's pretty clear that it's their absolute descent into wretchedness and the one-on-one nature of their conflict (regardless of moral/ethical considerations) that are what's actually important. (Sorry to go off a little on the fandom there...)

Not touching the Anya and Marianne thing because I'll be damned if I know. But her "bad mom"-meter rose significantly in this episode.

[tanzentravis.livejournal.com]

"In general, the fanbase seems to preoccupy itself on trying to gauge who is comparatively more right or wrong for any given episode, when (at least to me) it's pretty clear that it's their absolute descent into wretchedness and the one-on-one nature of their conflict (regardless of moral/ethical considerations) that are what's actually important. (Sorry to go off a little on the fandom there...)"

THANK YOU. That's what I've been thinking and wanting to say for a while but I didn't quite know how to say it. Neither side is right OR wrong, they're both goin' batshits. Kinda.

[ee970.livejournal.com]

I didn't think they told Xingke or Kaguya about Zero = Lelouch, especially after going through the trouble to show them watching the news on TV. Kaguya is a smart cookie, she could figure out that if someone is making trouble for Chaz, it's probably NANI MAI HUBBY--same as Schneizel did.

As for Marianne...I can't really hate since it means that real!CC is back, but what we've seen really doesn't seem to match with what I've heard of Marianne from her appearances in the novels, etc... I wonder if she is a "past" Marianne, much like the various CC's in her "soul room" thingie (world of C??? or is that Clovis's beach paradise island?). Either way, I think that Mary and Chaz are working together to do what they're doing... I just don't know what that is yet. @.@ At least we ought to be getting some exposition soon, hopefully Daddy and Lulu's family bonding...

[nekroskoma.livejournal.com]

your icon is win

that is all

[haphazard-mind.livejournal.com]

Did anyone else notice the obvious art style change, and different background music at certain parts throughout the episode?

And no, Lelouch was also drawn differently. They all were.

[furato.livejournal.com]

I must say, Kaguya's surprisingly smart under her usual LOL ZERO IS MAI HASBANDO ^_^ exterior.
I've always believed in Kaguya's intelligence and leadership the moment she did her famous Spinguya back in Tianzi's engagement party. I think given time, she just might grow into Schneizel's nemesis in conquering the world with a smile >:D

[consequences.livejournal.com]

I want to see that. 8D

[amayasuki.livejournal.com]

I'm really hoping her uncertainty about saving Lulu was the "I have confidence my son can pull his own ass out of the fire" thing. XD; Otherwise this is beyond tragic for Lelouch. Which... would make sense. -__- But wouldn't be a great message.

And boo to Suzaku completely snapping. He's not fun anymore... darn your Geass Lulu! You're turning him into a chicken too!

[levy.livejournal.com]

Of course Diethard was right in assessing that the power of Geass can't be revealed to the masses, but I really can't see a rational reason for the BK not telling Kaguya and Xing Ke the truth about Lelouch. .. Just to make them sound stupid, anco consequently make Lulu the awesomecake, Sunrise?
No, really, I demand an explanation for this, because this is gonna spoil the only advantage Japan took from the loss of Zero.. and, yeah, maybe it's just me, but I feel bad for japanese people, not only for the BK. IMHO, they deserve a future and some real peace, it can't be wasted in such a stupid way...

another thing that pisses me off is that now Lloyd and Cécile had lost part of their trust in Suzaku because they don't know anything about the Geass Lulu casted on him... ok, we know already that this show is built on angst but the epic lack of communication in ep 20 makes it sound at least... weird ° °