2008-04-21 18:59![[identity profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/openid.png)
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code_geass
nayami.livejournal.com in code_geassIt's so great to see our community activity with things aside from icons and RP ads again. All this discussion makes me a very happy Geass fan. But I still love my epic posts so here's another one. As always, no character bashing or I will eat your soul. I hear they go quite well with bread pudding.
It was refreshing to finally have an episode that gave us a chance to breathe and wrap out heads around some things without reeling from the OMG SHOCK of a moment before. I admit I was completely against an Ashford episode from the start and still believe that the plot should be dropped sooner rather than later. We were promised a world stage and yet we have yet to escape Japan. Much the same as Lelouch. Suzaku seems to be the only one with true freedom, but even that is debatable. I also think that this episode did a decent job of paralleling last season but to a much less irritating extent than previous ones. I still whine that all Lelouch did was sit on the horse. TEASES.
Since everyone is all over Rollo, I will deal with him later and instead put the perplexing issues of the episode to the forefront. The largest of these being GEASS. In Turn 2, we hear the Emperor tell Suzaku that only he knows about geass. I'm guessing this means he's the only KotR to know about geass. Clearly, other people do, although they may not know the full extent of the power. Villetta and Rollo chat about it. They also apparently bank on Lelouch's reliance on it it, a very poor move on their part, as most of Lelouch's building of his army was done without the use of his power (I will acknowledge winning them over was done through the geassing of Jeremiah and the rescue of Suzaku). Whoever is advising them that Lelouch abuses his power is working off a biased scenario. Is it Villetta's? Is it the Emperor's? Is it Suzaku's? Their observation itself is terribly hindered by the belief that Zero would immediately take action if Lelouch was back to his old ways. Again, the crew is not entirely playing with a full stack of cards. But I doubt the Emperor is this sloppy. And it's rather convenient that nobody knows what happened within Babel Tower if both of the group were apparently striving for the same thing.
I also have nit-pickery with Lelouch this time around. While I understand that the student council all had their memories rearranged to remove knowledge of Nunnally and Zero, meaning that Shirley was probably geassed a second time (a cop-out way to deal with the issue of her remembering things last season), Lelouch fully remembers what happened. I find it interesting that Lelouch is still willing to use Shirley to lure out Rollo and his other followers, knowing what he already put her through. I could even forgive this behavior, as Lelouch has always shown himself to be of the "ends justify the means" mindset if not for his later reaction. Upon Shirley pointing out the cable car, Lelouch suddenly feels guilt. Why was this guilt not present before? Did he conveniently shove it to the back of his mind? I fully believe that he feels responsible for what happened to his friends and wants to avenge them, but the combination of these two elements sat extremely awkwardly with me. It was almost like an afterthought. Even if Lelouch wouldn't know a date if it bit him on the ass, he knows how Shirley feels about him so agreeing to go do something with her would clearly count as playing into those feelings. Lelouch, you are a bastard. Though, I will add he was certainly hot when he was joking with Shirley about the spectacular trick he was going to play on the council.Talk wicked to me, baby.
People have pointed out Villetta's conflicted reaction to Ougi's fate. Interesting now that Villetta has some of the power she sought, noted by the surveillance members all referring to her as "lord." I am not sure how I feel about this since the Ougi/Villetta storyline was not one of my favorites. My interest in this is that Villetta seems somewhat... compromised and none too agitated by her role at Ashford. I would have thought a teacher would be demeaning for a warrior.
While we're exploring Britannia, we should also take a moment to brush over Schneizel and Suzaku. Some people have made some good comments about Suzaku's fight with the EU, particularly his focus on disabling rather than killing the pilots. Even if his words come across harsh, practically demanding their surrender, something feels different about this fight than his previous ones. Also Shinigami. I wonder if Suzaku did not earn the name from his homicidal battles in the Black Rebellion. There was no such quarter given then, and for good reason. Whatever Suzaku is after, there is a sense of weariness about him now. His final question to his opponents is whether they still want to continue fighting. Yes, Suzaku, may be different now, but his issues with outright killing seem to be a new spin on his old preservation. There could even be a degree more sanity involved in this style. Schneizel, who continues to be our red herring, alludes to as much when he talks about Suzaku bringing a sense of responsibility and conscience to the field. Ironic description for someone who would betray his own friend hmmm.
Lelouch has also returned to genuinely focusing on Nunnally, something that was missing quite heavily from previous episodes, and something that irked me. We see that he holds back because he's afraid of her being used as a bargaining chip, we see how resentful he is that the council has forgotten her and we see the rage toward the brother that replaced her. The locked, as some have suggested, was most likely a gift for her, purchased early, and then given to Rollo after Lelouch's memories were wiped. Hence, Lelouch's comment that a locket doesn't truly suit a boy. Ouch, Sunrise, giving them the same birthday. This is also where I point out that I love Lelouch's quiet, deadly rage when he makes this realization. Even if that one later frame was totally stole from the scene where Lelouch is watching Suzaku and Nunnally while deciding to tell Suzaku to be Nunnally's knight. As always, the majority of Lelouch's rage is turned toward his father.
Further following my attempt to sort out Lelouch's current thoughts on Suzaku is Lelouch's casual remark about Suzaku taking Arthur. Of course, it's adorable because it shows that Lelouch loev the kitty, as we all already knew. But that Lelouch automatically jumps to knowing that Arthur is with Suzaku is equally noteworthy. I have seen theories about Suzaku taking Arthur because of the cat's connection with Euphemia, thus Suzaku wanting to keep everything about Euphemia as far from Lelouch as possible. And here, I think Lelouch understands this. For his words are not bitter but a simple observation, an understanding as Lelouch always tries to boil things down to. Oh yeah, Lelouch also mentions Nina, which I assume is because she was another staple of Ashford that is now missing.
I am loving the theories I've seen floating about Rollo. While I was already intrigued by Lost Colors, the boy totally won me over with his shanking the Britannian guy and his later freakout in front of Lelouch. I am guessing Rollo is in a way a trained weapon because of his power. He may have been kept from people for a better part of his life or at least raised in a way that he felt perpetually detached. He doesn't care too much about following any orders but a prime directive, as seen in his killing of the guy who walks in on the secret of the geass. There is also his ability to switch modes, especially his creepy departure from the Chinese Embassy. I do buy into the notion that Rollo grew accustomed to his familial relationship with Lelouch and even started to believe it. He seems absolutely shocked in the scene where Lelouch gives him the locket and later reaffirms to himself that birthdays are important to people, furthering his belief that receiving the locket was a big deal. Add to that his total panic at losing it, at losing this reminder that he has family. Lelouch gave it to him! I love the raw emotion in his eyes in this scene. And his later confusion as Milly talks about Shirley possibly joining the family.
It is also hinted that Rollo doesn't want to give up his fake life, seen in Turn 1 with him trying to keep Lelouch from returning to his old ways and his attempts to convince himself that Lelouch can't possibly be this Zero in Turn 3. I especially love the way he still calls Lelouch "nii-san" because of his panic in the mall when he tries to reach Villetta. As always in geass, only an especially vicious catalyst manages to break the bond, with Rollo reverting back to "Lelouch" when Lelouch pulls a gun on him. His final words also speak to his take on his own power, referring to the geass as a "demon's eye." Perhaps Rollo resents what has happened to him because of his power; it can be suggested he is unstable with it at times. I guess here we can also toss in questions about who granted Rollo geass and how long he's had it. We've seen from Mao that geass can be given at a very young age, which I think is most likely with Rollo. But he also has managed to keep his control of it, possibly through outside influences.
I also want to give a shout-out to the music in this ep. "Masquerade" and also the cheesy but still amusing dramatic piece that plays out in the mall. I enjoyed. And I don't care what anyone says, I loved the cat-fight between C.C. and Kallen. I want more. It's not just fanservice; it's the development of their relationship, which was severely overlooked in S1.
Nope, no easy questions for you guys this time. They be in the analysis itself.
It was refreshing to finally have an episode that gave us a chance to breathe and wrap out heads around some things without reeling from the OMG SHOCK of a moment before. I admit I was completely against an Ashford episode from the start and still believe that the plot should be dropped sooner rather than later. We were promised a world stage and yet we have yet to escape Japan. Much the same as Lelouch. Suzaku seems to be the only one with true freedom, but even that is debatable. I also think that this episode did a decent job of paralleling last season but to a much less irritating extent than previous ones. I still whine that all Lelouch did was sit on the horse. TEASES.
Since everyone is all over Rollo, I will deal with him later and instead put the perplexing issues of the episode to the forefront. The largest of these being GEASS. In Turn 2, we hear the Emperor tell Suzaku that only he knows about geass. I'm guessing this means he's the only KotR to know about geass. Clearly, other people do, although they may not know the full extent of the power. Villetta and Rollo chat about it. They also apparently bank on Lelouch's reliance on it it, a very poor move on their part, as most of Lelouch's building of his army was done without the use of his power (I will acknowledge winning them over was done through the geassing of Jeremiah and the rescue of Suzaku). Whoever is advising them that Lelouch abuses his power is working off a biased scenario. Is it Villetta's? Is it the Emperor's? Is it Suzaku's? Their observation itself is terribly hindered by the belief that Zero would immediately take action if Lelouch was back to his old ways. Again, the crew is not entirely playing with a full stack of cards. But I doubt the Emperor is this sloppy. And it's rather convenient that nobody knows what happened within Babel Tower if both of the group were apparently striving for the same thing.
I also have nit-pickery with Lelouch this time around. While I understand that the student council all had their memories rearranged to remove knowledge of Nunnally and Zero, meaning that Shirley was probably geassed a second time (a cop-out way to deal with the issue of her remembering things last season), Lelouch fully remembers what happened. I find it interesting that Lelouch is still willing to use Shirley to lure out Rollo and his other followers, knowing what he already put her through. I could even forgive this behavior, as Lelouch has always shown himself to be of the "ends justify the means" mindset if not for his later reaction. Upon Shirley pointing out the cable car, Lelouch suddenly feels guilt. Why was this guilt not present before? Did he conveniently shove it to the back of his mind? I fully believe that he feels responsible for what happened to his friends and wants to avenge them, but the combination of these two elements sat extremely awkwardly with me. It was almost like an afterthought. Even if Lelouch wouldn't know a date if it bit him on the ass, he knows how Shirley feels about him so agreeing to go do something with her would clearly count as playing into those feelings. Lelouch, you are a bastard. Though, I will add he was certainly hot when he was joking with Shirley about the spectacular trick he was going to play on the council.
People have pointed out Villetta's conflicted reaction to Ougi's fate. Interesting now that Villetta has some of the power she sought, noted by the surveillance members all referring to her as "lord." I am not sure how I feel about this since the Ougi/Villetta storyline was not one of my favorites. My interest in this is that Villetta seems somewhat... compromised and none too agitated by her role at Ashford. I would have thought a teacher would be demeaning for a warrior.
While we're exploring Britannia, we should also take a moment to brush over Schneizel and Suzaku. Some people have made some good comments about Suzaku's fight with the EU, particularly his focus on disabling rather than killing the pilots. Even if his words come across harsh, practically demanding their surrender, something feels different about this fight than his previous ones. Also Shinigami. I wonder if Suzaku did not earn the name from his homicidal battles in the Black Rebellion. There was no such quarter given then, and for good reason. Whatever Suzaku is after, there is a sense of weariness about him now. His final question to his opponents is whether they still want to continue fighting. Yes, Suzaku, may be different now, but his issues with outright killing seem to be a new spin on his old preservation. There could even be a degree more sanity involved in this style. Schneizel, who continues to be our red herring, alludes to as much when he talks about Suzaku bringing a sense of responsibility and conscience to the field. Ironic description for someone who would betray his own friend hmmm.
Lelouch has also returned to genuinely focusing on Nunnally, something that was missing quite heavily from previous episodes, and something that irked me. We see that he holds back because he's afraid of her being used as a bargaining chip, we see how resentful he is that the council has forgotten her and we see the rage toward the brother that replaced her. The locked, as some have suggested, was most likely a gift for her, purchased early, and then given to Rollo after Lelouch's memories were wiped. Hence, Lelouch's comment that a locket doesn't truly suit a boy. Ouch, Sunrise, giving them the same birthday. This is also where I point out that I love Lelouch's quiet, deadly rage when he makes this realization. Even if that one later frame was totally stole from the scene where Lelouch is watching Suzaku and Nunnally while deciding to tell Suzaku to be Nunnally's knight. As always, the majority of Lelouch's rage is turned toward his father.
Further following my attempt to sort out Lelouch's current thoughts on Suzaku is Lelouch's casual remark about Suzaku taking Arthur. Of course, it's adorable because it shows that Lelouch loev the kitty, as we all already knew. But that Lelouch automatically jumps to knowing that Arthur is with Suzaku is equally noteworthy. I have seen theories about Suzaku taking Arthur because of the cat's connection with Euphemia, thus Suzaku wanting to keep everything about Euphemia as far from Lelouch as possible. And here, I think Lelouch understands this. For his words are not bitter but a simple observation, an understanding as Lelouch always tries to boil things down to. Oh yeah, Lelouch also mentions Nina, which I assume is because she was another staple of Ashford that is now missing.
I am loving the theories I've seen floating about Rollo. While I was already intrigued by Lost Colors, the boy totally won me over with his shanking the Britannian guy and his later freakout in front of Lelouch. I am guessing Rollo is in a way a trained weapon because of his power. He may have been kept from people for a better part of his life or at least raised in a way that he felt perpetually detached. He doesn't care too much about following any orders but a prime directive, as seen in his killing of the guy who walks in on the secret of the geass. There is also his ability to switch modes, especially his creepy departure from the Chinese Embassy. I do buy into the notion that Rollo grew accustomed to his familial relationship with Lelouch and even started to believe it. He seems absolutely shocked in the scene where Lelouch gives him the locket and later reaffirms to himself that birthdays are important to people, furthering his belief that receiving the locket was a big deal. Add to that his total panic at losing it, at losing this reminder that he has family. Lelouch gave it to him! I love the raw emotion in his eyes in this scene. And his later confusion as Milly talks about Shirley possibly joining the family.
It is also hinted that Rollo doesn't want to give up his fake life, seen in Turn 1 with him trying to keep Lelouch from returning to his old ways and his attempts to convince himself that Lelouch can't possibly be this Zero in Turn 3. I especially love the way he still calls Lelouch "nii-san" because of his panic in the mall when he tries to reach Villetta. As always in geass, only an especially vicious catalyst manages to break the bond, with Rollo reverting back to "Lelouch" when Lelouch pulls a gun on him. His final words also speak to his take on his own power, referring to the geass as a "demon's eye." Perhaps Rollo resents what has happened to him because of his power; it can be suggested he is unstable with it at times. I guess here we can also toss in questions about who granted Rollo geass and how long he's had it. We've seen from Mao that geass can be given at a very young age, which I think is most likely with Rollo. But he also has managed to keep his control of it, possibly through outside influences.
I also want to give a shout-out to the music in this ep. "Masquerade" and also the cheesy but still amusing dramatic piece that plays out in the mall. I enjoyed. And I don't care what anyone says, I loved the cat-fight between C.C. and Kallen. I want more. It's not just fanservice; it's the development of their relationship, which was severely overlooked in S1.
Nope, no easy questions for you guys this time. They be in the analysis itself.
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(no subject)
I don't want to assume. Oo... Or would you rather me say it all, anyway, because discussion is fun?
(no subject)
Don't get me wrong. I love both boys, but I always want to make sure that flaws are explored and acknowledged on both sides. Lelouch killed Euphie and has persisted in denying Suzaku the truth about what happened. I am not saying this is a bad decision, but it is the one he has made. Suzaku, with the knowledge he has, is in full rights to feel betrayed and vengeful.
(no subject)
I'm not sure I agree that Lulu didn't trust Suzaku in S1. Wasn't the situation with Mao proof that he did totally trust Suzaku? And he tried to understand Suzaku; he just failed. Can you really blame him for not getting what's going on in that boy's mind? I mean, none of us get it and we're watching from the outside. Srsly.
The only thing Lulu kept from Suzaku is Zero. And Suzaku's an idiot if he thought Lulu would come out and say, "Hey, yo. I'm trying to kill your supervisor." That just wouldn't end well. Not to mention it's actually a safe guard, leaving people in the dark. Otherwise Suzaku would have had a responsibility to stop him and they would have ended up fighting each other earlier. Lulu was hoping he'd never know.
Every time someone at my mom's school ends up in a court battle-and this happens a lot because she teaches in Miami-she always goes up to the person, when everyone else is asking for details, and says, "Don't tell me. I don't want to know. I don't want to have to testify against you in court." Suzaku's obviously still a little young if he doesn't see the value in that stance.
Lulu was looking out for him. In his position, the more people around him know, the more in danger they are. Shirley and Kallen are perfect examples of this.
I'd even venture to say the one who was keeping more secrets is Suzaku. Lulu had to find out as Zero what Suzaku's been spending all his time doing. It's one thing to keep the fact that you're a terrorist from someone; it's another to keep totally legal, noble deeds from someone. Why didn't Suzaku tell Lulu that he piloted a knightmare? Why didn't he talk about meeting Euphemia? I'd feel pretty shocked and betrayed, too, if I thought someone was protecting me only to discover later that it was for someone else's sake, not mine. Here, Lulu thought Suzaku's devotion was to himself and Nunally, and then in one fell swoop that security rug was yanked out from under him. No duh he wouldn't trust him after that. Lulu couldn't be sure where Suzaku's loyalty was, and he'd been getting lots of fun little tidbits of evidence pointing toward the military over himself and his sister.
Ah, but Suzaku doesn’t see it like that.
(no subject)
I do see the selling out as betrayal because he helped hurt Lelouch in the worst possible way -- taking away the one thing Lelouch holds most dear: Nunnally, as well as his sense of self. Whether Lelouch understands is debatable but Lelouch is smart and knows he's kept Suzaku in the dark so...
No, Lelouch didn't try to understand Suzaku. Not to the extent he could have. He continuously tried to push Suzaku back into the way he knew him. The creators have confirmed this in interviews. While I fully believe Lelouch geassing Suzaku was in part an unconscious desire to save Suzaku, it also speaks again to Lelouch's unconscious desire to set Suzaku right again. *His* Suzaku is not suicidal. *His* Suzaku would not bow down to Britannia. Lelouch has been described by his creators as a pissy ex-girlfriend who doesn't want to really understand what's happened to the person they knew. That is the main reason I accuse Lelouch of not giving Suzaku fair ground because I would prefer to see it otherwise.
But I do like your comment about not telling Suzaku about Zero as a safeguard to prevent compromising Suzaku. There is more to it, I think. Lelouch didn't truly want to test Suzaku's loyalty. As Realms suggests, he may expect betrayal but at the same time hope and try to pretend it won't happen. As much as Lelouch trusted Suzaku with his life, he couldn't trust him with that part of him. If I was in a corny mood, I would say his heart. But I won't so insert your own description here. There is also the pride issue of wanting to win Suzaku over through reasoning rather than reliance on something more emotional -- the friendship.
Suzaku didn't talk to Lelouch about his dealings because he knows Lelouch hates Britannia. There is also the fact that Suzaku's division was a secret and experimental. There might have been clearance issues involved. I've already taken on the Euphemia issue in my other comment to you. It's more personal to Suzaku and related to his conditioning within Britannia. Suzaku was not protect Nunnally and Lelouch just for Euphie. It was why he was in school, but everything he did with them, it was for them. I don't think there's anything to suggest Suzaku's relationship with the Lamperouges was solely for his princess. Again, I don't think they spent that much time together before she made him her knight. He probably wasn't allowed to. Lelouch wasn't angry that Suzaku was doing this for someone else; he was angry that Suzaku had chosen Britannia over him and Nunnally. He was angry that Suzaku had ruined all his plans. He was angry that Suzaku left him. I would daresay Lelouch was jealous. But not just toward Suzaku. Also, once he knew of Suzaku's place in Britannia, it was even more risky to try revealing himself and testing that friendship.
They are both liars and manipulators. They are sinners. And they betrayed each other even as they looked out for each other. Theirs are crimes of omission and whether one is more justified than the other is irrelevant. Suzaku ultimately betrayed Lelouch by not standing by his side as he had always promised him since they were children, and Lelouch ultimately betrayed Suzaku by shattering the one thing Suzaku had left to hold: his faith in those he loved.
(no subject)
They are both liars and manipulators. They are sinners. And they betrayed each other even as they looked out for each other. Theirs are crimes of omission and whether one is more justified than the other is irrelevant. Suzaku ultimately betrayed Lelouch by not standing by his side as he had always promised him since they were children, and Lelouch ultimately betrayed Suzaku by shattering the one thing Suzaku had left to hold: his faith in those he loved.
And yes, omission is such a HUGE issue in Code Geass. We must always look at what is not happening, what people failed to say or do, what is missing in a scene - like Lelouch never asking what Suzaku has been up to in the last seven years. Sometimes what is not there tells more about the characters than anything else.
(no subject)
You are totally right about Lelouch not talking about Zero to Suzaku being a form of protecting himself AND Suzaku. Also, as Zero, Lelouch tries to turn Suzaku against Britannia many times, and as Lelouch, he is very attentive to Suzaku's views on Zero. Still, he hoped after hoped that Suzaku would side with him until the very end. And that's another lovely paradox, imo.