Question about reactions to ep 6

[sumeragiskank.livejournal.com]

I seriously loved this episode and all of the great Lloyd and Suzaku moments in it. But I'm kinda scratching my head after reading some reactions to it that make no sense to me. I've not been very involved in Geass fandom and am rather shocked at some of the prevailing attitudes ^^;;;



I'm rather confused as to why everyone thinks Nunally has been brainwashed by Suzaku. After all, he's not the one who actually uses an evil brainwashing power to murder people. That's Lelouch. He's never used someone important to him as a political tool. Again, that's Lelouch. And if you want to argue that he used Lelouch, I think he had more than enough right to do so after Lelouch murdered Euphie and completely fucked over his country and plans for peace.

I'm glad to see Nunally taking some initiative and for them to develop her character more. I also am eagerly awaiting to see her reaction to learning Lelouch is Zero. I was glad she told him he was wrong. Because he is. And I do not think that, even as much as she loves her brother, she is going to take very kindly to the knowledge that he has been murdering people left and right and committing all sorts of atrocities all in her name. She'll likely be horrified and so far, no Britannian telling her has been a mercy. Lelouch has made this bed for himself and he seems awfully upset that now he has to lie in it. Poor baby. This is me feeling completely not sorry for him.

I like Lelouch as a character, but I hold no illusions that he's a nice person in the least. He puts selfish goals ahead of the plight of an entire nation of downtrodden people, nevermind lying to, manipulating, and using people who honestly care for him. Along with murdering family members and innocent people in cold blood and all of that. I don't think the ends ever justify the means, and while he had good intentions at some point - is he now going to fuck over Nunally for his own goals and ego or will he let her lead her own life - I think Lelouch's pretty far along on his trip to hell. I jiust don't understand why everything Suzaku does wrong is picked apart and held against him while Lelouch's various crimes, which are a much much much much longer list, are immediately forgiven. I understand that he's the main character and all, but I just can't give him that leeway and have to hold him to the same standards as every other character.

Comments

[powercorrupts.livejournal.com]

I'm not sure what I find more irritating - the people who justify away everything Lelouch does or the people who justify away everything Suzaku does.

Lelouch is not a sparkly happy normal protagonist. He is out for revenge, he is willing to use dirty tactics, and he feels that the ends justify the means. He is, however, not some sort of demented sociopath on a rampage of death with no care about anything, either. Every time I see either characterization, I find myself clicking the back button before I have to read too much of it, because my blood pressure isn't the best to begin with.

I'll agree with you that somehow quite a few people in this fandom are ridiculously quick to write off everything he does as perfectly acceptable. I can't count how many times I've gotten in an argument with someone (sometimes on this community) who was trying to justify something Lelouch did with strange reasons, or argue that he would never ever do something that he actually ends up doing. But on the other hand, I also think he gets a lot of flack on other sites (/a/ comes immediately to mind), and there are still plenty of people here who seem to want paint him as some sort of evil character, when in my opinion that's exactly what the show is trying to avoid. If Geass wanted to give us completely black and white, stereotypical concepts of good and evil, they wouldn't have given us a typical mecha show hero as an antagonist, and a somewhat villainous figure as the protagonist.

And neither is Suzaku perfectly correct, or perfectly inhuman. Somehow it seems that the overwhelming majority of this fandom is somehow unable to comprehend outside of typical "villain/hero" lines, which I find absolutely depressing in a show that is obviously attempting to subvert that trope as hard as it can.

I think you come off a little harsh about the matter, of course. Bashing Lelouch left and right isn't made right just because people do so about Suzaku. I don't see how it somehow fixes anything - if you want to rant about people being unfair in how they feel about a fictional character, trying to rile people up by doing the same isn't exactly the most mature way to go about it.

[rainbow-cnxn.livejournal.com]

I can't agree with your post any harder, especially this bit:

Somehow it seems that the overwhelming majority of this fandom is somehow unable to comprehend outside of typical "villain/hero" lines, which I find absolutely depressing in a show that is obviously attempting to subvert that trope as hard as it can.

This is why /a/ and AS make me a sad panda. That and people are constantly unable to separate their own values from that of the characters'. You mean that an omniscient, emotionally-detached viewer would perceive a situation differently than a confused, traumatized teenager? SAY IT AIN'T SO! -_-

[firebird-88.livejournal.com]

I love that last paragraph of yours. If I had it my way, I wouldn't be picking sides to begin with because Geass is simply not meant to be black and white. And bashing any side isn't a good way to start a debate, you'll only get people who vehemently agree with you or are vehemently defense about said character. I REALLY dislike the world "evil" being thrown around fandoms like this. :-/

[sumeragiskank.livejournal.com]

I think they both have their flaws, and I see it's not clear, but I LIKE Lelouch as a character. He is interesting and really should be my fave character based on my own personal likes and dislikes. I do not agree with his philosophy and find it a little disconcerting that so many people seem to feel that the ends justify the means is a perfectly valid excuse to kill people. *shrugs* It's just after so many Suzaku hating posts, you feel like someone needs to stick up for him because he's not the evil bastard a lot of people say he is. And I really don't understand how he can be painted black while Lelouch is sainted.

[bacon-sensei.livejournal.com]

Thank you. THANK YOU. First comment that actually attempted to put the bias, petty bickering that makes the Code Geass fandom such a turn-off.

[asylums.livejournal.com]

IAWTC