One giant set-up?

[darth-teca.livejournal.com]

Is anyone else REALLY getting the impression that Lelouch's, and Schniezel's for that matter, entire life has been shaped by the Emporer as one big contest of who REALLY deserves to take the thrown/kill the Gods? It's the impression I've had for a while about the series but it's becoming more and more likely in my mind, especially with some of the recent developments shown in Ep 13. Here are the major ones:

~V.V. and Charles both have referred to the pact they have made to kill the Gods in past tense, with almost a sense that they've had the agreement for a long time. Considering they are brothers, I would probably guess that this pact could easily be going back a LONG time ago. If this is true and they've had the pact for so long, why haven't they actually completed the pact yet? Given, no one really has any idea what they are actually talking about, but it would seem that whatever it is, they are probably incapable of doing it on their own and/or need someone to do something specific to complete the pact. In steps Lelouch.

~One of the shots in the new OP is what looks like Charles, V.V. and a woman standing on a cliff that C.C. was shown standing on in an earlier OP. It seems that many people agree that this woman is probably Marianne.If this is true, than that's a pretty strong indication that Marianne probably had some knowledge of Geass. Paired with the previous information that Marianne herself dismissed all her security the day she was assassinated seems to suggest that Lelouch's hardship could possibly have been planned out from the beginning, to make him stronger and force him to become ruthless. He was sent away to a foreign country, which cuts him off from the rest of his family. During the invasion of Japan, everyone seemed to simply assume Lelouch and Nunally died, but I don't buy that Charles would think that. The Ashford's were known associates and supporters of Marianne, so it would stand to reason that they would probably take care of her children. Charles might have hoped/counted on them to act upon their loyalties, which is a huge theme in Geass in general.

~Both of the assassins that the Order has sent after Lelouch have turned to his side. Either the Order is incredibly short-sighted in what the actual motivations of their assassins are, or Charles is beginning to stack Lelouch's deck a little higher. You do NOT send an emotionally unbalanced child who has had no family on an undercover job to be IN a family with an extremely manipulative enemy. You CERTAINLY don't send a soldier who was in the service of the mother of said enemy to go kill them. Again, loyalty is a large theme in Geass, people depend on it a lot through their relationships, and Jerimiah doesn't strike me as the kind to have been quite about his loyalty to Marianne, even though it was his first mission. How "convenient" that if it was know of is loyalty to her, his first mission to actually protect her is the very day she dies. Even more "convenient" is the chance to help her son avenge her death. That's a lot of stacked up conveniences that now knowing what we know, I don't buy very well.

~There are other little things (like why would Britania keep C.C. in Japan in the first place? Wouldn't actually inside Britania be much safer and more secure?), but I think the one wild card in Nunally. Personally, I think she was supposed to have died with Marianne, but Marianne protected her instead. The recent flashback of Lelouch's memory of Marianne's assassination shows the bullets peppering the area around Marianne and Nunally but making a clean have cicle around Lelouch. If any of the above is true as well, it would make sense to have Nunally dead because then Lelouch really has nothing to keep him from pulling out all the stops, completely losing and removed from everyone he loves. No idea why Charles would have let her live, other than supposing trying to kill her again would look too suspicious.

~While all of this is arguably happening with Lelouch, it's much more obvious that the King is moving Schniezel to be in direct conflict with Lelouch and while upping up his own arsenal. He's given Schniezel three Knights of the Round, and possibly more on the way later. Chales is also ordering Schniezel to try and gain half of the Chinese territory, an move that will obviously put him in a head-to-head conflict with Lelouch. Both sides are gaining a ton of power, pushing both of them to possibly create battles and decisions that they wouldn't have made without so much power on their side.

Obviously, this is all wide speculation, but it's pretty clear that with the chess motif, Schniezel is the white king and Lelouch is the black king. While they move their respective pieces/people around the board, I don't believe that they are willingly moving themselves. I think Charles is the hand that set-up the game, made the rules, and is moving the kings. After all, where the kings go, the pawns are sure to follow. Maybe the battle alone is the act to "killing the Gods" or maybe the one remaining after it's all done will be able to complete the pact, but I smell something being rigged in the air.

Comments

[luinthoron.livejournal.com]

I think it was already clear in the first season that Lelouch was, despite hating them, following exactly the Emperor's ideals of competition for the throne. Survival of the fittest and so on... In going against his family, he's doing exactly what his father is expecting from all his children. He might even really be the Emperor's favorite since he's the only one not just competing with the other princes/princesses but actually trying to attack his father.

[glorfindel.livejournal.com]

~While all of this is arguably happening with Lelouch, it's much more obvious that the King is moving Schniezel to be in direct conflict with Lelouch and while upping up his own arsenal.
oh god... i misread the last word as 'arousal'. okay, kill me now XD

but anyway, you've got some interesting points there ^^

[imouto.livejournal.com]

You made me shoot frosted flakes out my nose!


Owww....

[lavaliere]

Interesting thoughts. But like luinthoron says, Lelouch seems to be fitting into his father's ideals of Social Darwinism, despite his very vocal hatred for the man. This could simply be a bit of irony, but it's still true.

Also... why would Britania keep C.C. in Japan in the first place?

Clovis says himself (which is later acknowledged by General Bradley) that C.C. was an expiriment under his rule, not necessarily that of his father's. He even says something along the lines of "I'll be disinherited" if knowledge of his expiriments on C.C. got out.

Other than that, your theory does sound kind of valid (and intriguing too). :)

[unsugared.livejournal.com]

I've been thinking about it as well, especially after watching Turn 11 when C.C and Anya had some sort of connection between them. I don't know whose memory was it, but an image of Lelouch and Nunnally with Charles in the background triggered that, I supposed. It can be assumed that Charles was close with Lelouch and Nunnally before something happened.

kogoetahana had told me before too, that Charles killing Marianne would be too easy to predict. Maybe it was planned to make Lelouch who he is now? And Marianne is also involved, somehow.

Another one thing, why Schniezel and not his other siblings? And I wonder, does anyone else know about this, apart from Charles and V.V?

[ansela-jonla.livejournal.com]

I think that Schneizel and Cornelia are the most competent of the older Princes and Princesses. The 1st Prince (Odysseus?) seems to be completely useless and it's possible that the others aren't really all that good on the battlefield.

[tanzentravis.livejournal.com]

Urm, sorry for the double comment.

But yeah - Odysseus always comes across as aloof and indecisive, so that's not someone I would imagine Charles giving his throne up to.

[tanzentravis.livejournal.com]

I just assume that the reason the Emperor is so high on Schneizel is because he's the most well-balanced of the family (or so it seems, anyway). It seems that everyone else has a characteristic that's taken to the extreme except for Schneizel.

Oh, and I can't help but have a quick *wheezewheezefanboy* moment - Cornelia is terribly badass.

[unsugared.livejournal.com]

Talking about this long lineage of siblings reminds me of one thing, why Lelouch of all people??

Of course, we have 'Because-he-is-the-main-character,-that's-why' thingy, but still...

*fangirls with you* Yes, Cornelia is one badass!Princess. Will she be joining Lelouch too?

[tanzentravis.livejournal.com]

In regards to the second part of your post, I doubt it. She's hellbent on proving Euphie's innocence AND Lelou is pretty much responsible for the Euphie tragedy. I see Cornelia as being a little bit like Suzaku, unable to forgive in regards to that incident.

[tomoyohime8.livejournal.com]

but there's also the fact that she understands lelouch's reason for fighting. i remember something about cornelia admiring marianne a lot (or is that just somthing i got from fanfiction? sorry, my head is kinda spinny at 1 am.)

i think her quest includes soul-searching, (used for lack of a better term) wherein she's trying to figure out what she's going to do next, what euphie would want her to do.

i personally though am very excited about what orange-kun and lulu can accomplish together. ^^b

[tanzentravis.livejournal.com]

No, you're right. Around the middle (or end) of R1 when Lelouch has Cornelia in checkmate (so to speak) she mentions that she looked up to Marianne and did a lot of investigation into her death afterward.

[tomoyohime8.livejournal.com]

so i'm not losing my grip on canon (too much fanfiction can mess with your head sometimes, especially the really good ones. they almost sound canon. ^^) thank geass for small miracles.

i love cornelia. i hope she shows up more in the next episodes.

[darth-teca.livejournal.com]

As to why Lelouch, I think it was planned out since before his birth. Hell, even his BIRTH might have been planned with all of this in mind. People who can give Geass seem to have the ability to tell/sense when someone is able to receive Geass or be of some use to them or SOMETHING. It might be that V.V. could tell with Lelouch from when he was very young.

[darth-teca.livejournal.com]

I agree with everyone else that his first round of children aren't really his ideal in who would take over his thrown when he left. Even Lelouch seems to have a low regard for Odyssesus (or however you spell it). Schniezel is just the best of Charles' other children, so he's the one being pitted up against Lelouch.

[boopkit.livejournal.com]

Interesting thoughts, indeed~

And saying "I still have my use of you" instead of "lol kill him Suzaku" when Lelouch was captured, is supporting some of the ideas you wrote up there.

[darth-teca.livejournal.com]

Very true. I would guess that perhaps R1 was Charles first go at it, but Euphie's actions completely ruined the whole thing. So he basically "re-set" the board and started again, but now is having a bit more of an active part in building up to the climax.

[loika.livejournal.com]

I'm almost certain Marianne knew about the existence of Geass, as well as V.V. and C.C.. If the image in the new OP isn't enough, I distinctly remember C.C. "talking" to her during an episode in season one. So yes, I think there's a possibility that she allowed herself to be killed.

[recodes.livejournal.com]

Uh, yes... I always have the feeling that everything that has happend in CG had been predetermined by a mastermind. For all we know, Charles and V.V seemed to be too relaxed in regard of everything that seems to be happening around them. I know that he once mentioned that "Only fools wage war", so it looks to me like he doesn't have a good stand when he himself wages war. Pot calling the kettle black, Charles??

Good point about Charles and V.V's pact. What I would like to know now is when exactly Charles entered into a contract with V.V. It might also have something to do with why is V.V an immortal when Charles isn't even though they are twin brothers. And before this I thought V.V had lived for centuries, but wouldn't that mean Charles had too? So I'm guessing something happened when they were young, and little V.V got stuck in his young body while his mind aged as he became an immortal/acquianted with the Geass Cult. (How old is Charles again??) But the problem is WHY?

And what about their pact - destroying the gods. What are they up to, and what are they actually referring to? We see in the latest episodes that Bartley freaked out, saying that they were committing the worse crime in history. I'm really at lost there. It seems that no one knows of what Charles and V.V were doing behind the scenes.

And it also unnerves me that V.V seems to be handling most of the events. We don't actually see Charles giving orders, it was always V.V telling them it was the Emperor's order. Don't you think that's a bit fishy?

==============

And I have to say I agree with your mention of their choice in assasins. Either they really were planning something, or Sunrise was too dumb to notice the plotholes (we know it happened many times in their shows). In one way or another, it's like they have predicted that Rolo and Jeremiah would switch sides because of Lelouch (even though for different reasons). And why, pray tell, would V.V gives Jeremiah a Geass Canceler and assign him to assasinate Lelouch?

While many others including even Suzaku (let's ignore the argument that he's dense beyond help) was doubting that the newly revived Zero was the same as the previous Zero, V.V was more than certain. Again, it's V.V, not Charles. He said it would be trouble if Zero's aim was the cult, and sent Jeremiah promptly after Lelouch.

Hmm?

This only means that V.V knows that Rolo had switched sides. Rolo was originally ordered to assasinate Lelouch if the guy happens to regain his memories and reawaken as Zero. Otherwise, why would he go and send someone else?

And I think I'm missing something. Does Suzaku knows that Rolo was ordered to kill Lelouch if his memories return? It doesn't look like that's the case here, and I always wonder...

Marianne.

Oh dear, I don't even know where to start. If the magazine scans say anything, then something REALLY important must have happened 21 years ago when Marianne was still a knight, probably something that became one of the causes (if not THE cause) of the present conflicts.

It's either she knows something about Geass or Marianne herself was directly involved with the Geass Cult. Who knows if she had the power of Geass herself?

Why did she request for the security level to be at the minimum the day she was assasinated? Was she Geassed by somebody else, or was she involved in some kind of ploy? But what ploy? It must have been something very significant to the present conflicts if she was ready to sacrifice herself. She must have predicted the outcome of her death, and what would become of her children in the aftermath.

===========

Alas, I am thoroughly confused about Schneizel and his stand. So I won't be commenting about his recent active role yet. Need to think first.

============

Gah... I. Am. Confused ... by my own thoughts @_@

[recodes.livejournal.com]

Gah, I forgot to add something up there.

Why give Jeremiah a Geass Canceler that would cancel all type of Geasses including Charles'????? Isn't that going against Charles' plan?

Okay, I give up. What's the plan anyway?

[unsugared.livejournal.com]

...

...

*brain explodes*

Instead of answering the confusion mentioned above, you just add more. It's just you, isn't it, dearest?

Let's not forget about our discussion that V.V might be working behind Charles without him knowing anything?

[csakura.livejournal.com]

oy my brain is spinning ~ all these masterminds and their elaborate plots.

v.v. looks pretty nutso in the previews for next ep, looking forward to it..

[recodes.livejournal.com]

Let's not forget about our discussion that V.V might be working behind Charles without him knowing anything?

Dearest, that's exactly the semi-long essay I just wrote above, in case you didn't notice...?

~_~

[darth-teca.livejournal.com]

Hmmm... I've been thinking about this myself, and here's what I've come up with. Let me know what you think.

V.V. seems to already know that Lelouch is Zero, and if we assume that V.V. and Charles are in fact a team, then Charles already knows that his Geass is gone anyway. If Charles/V.V. did in fact want this to happen, than giving Lelouch a Geass Cancelor is a brilliant move. I think that R1 was the first go at Lelouch doing whatever it was he was supposed to do, but Euphie botched the whole deal with first creating the Special Area of Japan, and then by getting Geassed by Lelouch accidentally. C.C. did mention that the contact would only work so long as Lelouch's Geass didn't get any stronger, which we can safetly say is probably going to happen at some point or another. To make sure another Euphie-like incident doesn't happen again, Lelouch now has Jerimiah to cancel out any potential mess-ups. It makes it so random happenings won't stop Lelouch from acting with his full potential.

... Or if we assume that this isn't one big plot by Charles, Jerimiah can control when his Anti-Geass goes off, so he could just have been told to investigate whether Lelouch really had lost his memories or not. It became pretty obvious rather quickly that Lelouch in fact had regained his memories, when the men Jerimiah asked about Lelouch's location pulled their guns on him.

The kicker is, we don't know what the plan is, or even if there is one. XD Oh Geass, I do love you.

[scuba-dooba.livejournal.com]

Charles is around 60. I'm thinking 62, but I'm not sure.

[darth-teca.livejournal.com]

At the moment, I think everything points to V.V. and Charles having a similar relationship to C.C. and Lelouch, being that both pairs are bound by at the very least the contracts made with each other. V.V. and Charles are also twins, meaning that they have an even closer bond. While you very well could be right that V.V. is acting solo, I think that both Charles and V.V. are working towards the same goal, but at different angles. V.V. is pressuring and manipulating from one side, Charles from the other.

I think it's also a good point about V.V. just taking Lelouch being back as Zero in stride. And almost even boarded with it all. I wouldn't be surprised if Charles and V.V. had counted on it. Especially since I can't really blame Suzaku for not being sure what is going on. There's an entire Britannian Intelligence Unit set-up with the sole purpose of WATCHING Lelouch, run by a woman who shot her lover in the back during the last rebellion to turn him and the others in. It's hard to question that type of loyalty, and on top of that, everyone at school is saying they talked and saw Lelouch when Zero was obviously running around Japan. All of the evidence is pointing to the Lelouch is not Zero, so I do have to give Suzaku credit for not giving up on his gut instinct and not believing any of it.

Oooo, I hadn't thought of Marianne being involved with the Geass Cult herself, separate of Charles. Now there's something to ponder on for a while. XD

[sapphirus.livejournal.com]

If Lelouch is the black king, and Schneizel is the white king...Then according to OP, it stands to reason that C.C.'s the black queen and Nunnally's the white queen, yes?

Other than that... i-mostly-awtp?

[darth-teca.livejournal.com]

It certainly could be. Although... It might just be the case that the white queen has been forever moved off the board; namely, Euphie. I still hold to that parallel between her and C.C. that got set-up in the first season. Nunally is still a wild card in my opinion and could potentially fall to either side. Or no side, for that matter.

[geordiedragon.livejournal.com]

This is just some speculation but I think that V.V and Charles, and maybe even Marianne plotted her death to turn Lelouch into Zero, as part of Charles' plot of destroying the Gods, cause V.V does certainately seem to be in control and neither Charles nor V.V seem to consider Zero to be much of a threat.