A Question About Ore vs. Boku vs. Watashi

[lavaliere]

I think we've all had enough with posts relating to Episode 19, yes? Even if I still get teary-eyed just thinking about it So, let's have a bit of a discussion.

Forgive me if this has been discussed before. I haven't seen a post on it, so....

Even those of us who completely fail at moonspeak Japanese are able to pick up certain words and phrases at times. I do this, myself, from time to time. And so, going back to watch the first season again, I picked up on something I hadn't before. Zero refers to himself with the watashi form of me or I whereas Lelouch uses ore.

Now, I understand that the way a person refers to themselves depends greatly on their personality. Someone who is more polite tends to use boku or watashi while a guy who is more self-assured might use ore. Those that are very self-assured, or even egotistic might use ore-sama.

We know that Suzaku switches between ore and boku usually when he's affected by the Live Geass or certain aspects of his past. But why does Lelouch switch between ore as his usual self and watashi as Zero? Is it just to keep people wondering about the true identity of Zero or do you think there's another reason?

I mean, Suzaku seems to differentiate between Zero and Lelouch, choosing to see them as two seperate people at times. Rolo does it too, sometimes, but not nearly as often as Suzaku and eventually drops the concept all together after Lelouch sways him to his side. Does anyone else do this as well? Does Lelouch see himself and Zero as two different people or does he see them as one and the same? I'm thinking he believes he and Zero are one and the same, so why the use of watashi? Why not even just boku?

Comments

[kadekmoment.livejournal.com]

I think "watashi" at least at the beginning was for a completely neutral, mysterious persona that could embody everything and nothing. Perfect for a leader whose identity was supposed to remain a total secret. But as it went on, I do think that he began to separate the personas as he needed them in his life (before they began to fuse when he started going into battles unmasked, etc.).

THESE ARE MY QUICK THOUGHTS

[kagu-chan.livejournal.com]

Watashi is a generally polite or formal form of referring to oneself (the more formal being watakushi, which I think Euphie uses?). It's more appropriate language to be used by someone who leads an organized group unless said person is very deliberately devil-may-care or rude/rough (see Tamaki) or informal. Old-fashioned types like the leaders of the Japan Liberation Front would use ware, I think. Correct me if I'm wrong. :(

[nokiirat.livejournal.com]

please use a lj-cut

[helreginn.livejournal.com]

Watakushi is used by Euphemia (not too sure) and Nunnally. Or, say, if you're familiar with Ouran Host Club, the girls all used Watakushi, with few exceptions here and there. But the more polite girls would use watakushi. It's quite polite and formal as well. Watashi is also the same. Though I suppose men would prefer watashi over watakushi, though I've seen male characters use it too, can't remember where however.

If you could compare Lelouch with Tamaki (of Ouran) *dies of the crack* while acting as a host, in front of the ladies, he uses Watashi, but in between club members and friends, he uses ore.

Boku (I think means servant somehow), so is very humble and so people like Suzaku, Subaru, Seishirou (from TB/X) use it. (Though Seishirou is mostly wrong in the head...but anyway.)

Ore is rude, of course. But young boys use it until they get a bit old. Or so I've heard/read somewhere. Lelouch is definitely normal (for people to see), so he uses ore. However, I think if he used ore as Zero, it might be revealed that he's young. *shrugs* it can be one of the reasons, besides, using Watashi for being who he is, suits much better than any other word.

As to "ware", it means "us/we" like "waga" (Not too sure on that. Waga does mean "we/us" though). It's a very arrogant way of saying I. However, it also can be attributed to being old and veteran. Usually, old people use "washi". Wara, warera I think mean the same thing, plurals of it. Gaaah, it's complicated. >.>;

Euphemia used watakushi when she was making Suzaku a knight. Then she used a very...odd form of you. I'm not sure how to spell it, but the word seemed archaic. (I've only seen it used in anime like Trinity Blood wherein the vampires used archaic language, so it would be something like "thou" XD)

I don't think that made any sense. @_@ Sorry!

[scuba-dooba.livejournal.com]

According to this website:http://www.geocities.com/tokyo/subway/4346/anime/boku.html, "ore" is an almost exclusively male, somewhat rude, "cool" pronoun for "I" or "me", "boku" is mostly young male for "I" or "me", and "watashi" is the standard and polite way to say "I" or "me".

Perhaps Lelouch uses "watashi" as Zero both to differentiate between his two personas and because "watashi", coming from a leader, is more pleasing to the ear of the public. Like, if a supposed hero doesn't respect you-he isn't polite when he talks to you, why should you respect him?

Or something. I'm just thinking out loud.

[nefadol.livejournal.com]

One thing I noticed while rewatching the first season a while back was that Lelouch used boku when he was a child and also used it again when he was talking to Clovis. He hasn't used it since that time from what I've noticed.

It is kind of interesting though, Lelouch went from boku to ore while Suzaku did the opposite.

[himeno-sakura.livejournal.com]

In kansai dialect, you often here people refer to themselves as "washi" and "uchi". I think "uchi" is used mainly by girls. When I speak Japanese, I use "Watashi", while my friend uses "Atashi".